electrial pricing

[hunter]

We got a bid for electricals which priced each recess can, outlet, fixture,
220v circuit, individually. When we got the bill and it was all itemized they were still priced individually but something that was never mentioned in the orginal bid was added. It said 3 panel boxes and circuits at 3,300 dollars each. Could you please tell me if this is a normal price for the breaker boxes? It added 10,000 dollars to the bill.

[dhill]

Why three panel boxes? Is this residential or commercial?

[hunter]

It is residential....My parents and my husbands mom moved in with us so it is 6300 sf. heated.

[Rich]

I guess they probably added sub-panels. 10k seems a little steep but it's been awhile since I've had to buy any electrical short of switches and outlets.
Well besides the price - the contractor upon knowing of a cost increase should have notified you of the additional costs. If the work was done without a signed change order (this of course assumes a contract requiring change orders) then there should be no cost increase.

[kadoka]

They must be running three separate service entries to get to that cost. A good 200 amp panel is only a few hundred dollars.

[hunter]

The electrician is "friends" with the contractor. I was given the original bid after the work was started. It was in paragraph form and it listed # fixt outlets, #recess fixture otlets, #recess fixtures,#cr1 recess no trim/lamp,#cr4 cans no trim/lamp,#single pole switch, etc. There were no prices except the final total which I commented was high. Later I received their pricing list and it still didn't add up to final total. I said I needed to have individual pricing to add to total. I was told that they have never had to do that for anyone and I was out of line for asking for that. They did give it to me and I noticed it listed panels and breakers at 3,300 each to get to the final total given at the end of the paragraph on the orginal bid. Panels were never mentioned in the original bid. I assumed they were in the pricing of the individual things. I did pay it but was also charged for every visit to change cans etc. In the end the lighting company put up more than the electricians put up. I now need them to "finish" the greenhouse for my parents...but if I have already paid them too much then I don't want to make the same mistake twice.
What do you think?

[N2Deep]

just you give you comparison

Quote for Las Vegas Area
$2 a square foot
+1000 to upgrade 200Amp panel to 400Amp
+$50 for each Can light
includes installing all light fixtures and ceiling fans
phone and satellite wiring included.

I ended up doing my own and only paid about half the cost.
but a lot of work.

Hope that helps.

[hunter]

thanks to everyone for the good info.
N2Deep--I really appreciate the numbers for comparison....
I priced the 200 amp 40 space panel at $195 at Home Depot. I also priced out all the breakers inside each panel. If my pricing is right it shows a profit of $8000.00 for all 3 panels at retail pricing. I must be doing something wrong. OR did I just get the royal snow job!?
How can I tell if I have a 200amp or 400amp panel?

[giddonah]

I've found electrical to be pretty bad in my area too. $3k to install a new breaker box 4ft away from the old one. I spit on towns that require licensed work. May they rot in hell.

[kadoka]

Here in Colorado the home owner can do their own electrical work, just their own.

[dhill]

The main breaker in a 200 amp panel will show 200 amp as will the 400. As far as the box, I'm not sure you're going to see any difference. The box is sized many times according to the space for breakers, not necessarily the amps. I think that 3 boxes at 3K each is way too expensive. However, if they are running service, they may be including running oversized wiring to those boxes. I'm not sure how your installation is working. It's not unusual for the price to sky-rocket if service is extended beyone an allowable distance by your service provider.
Of course, you can save lots of money by doing it yourself, but even though it's a pain to have to deal with things like codes and inspection, it's necessary most of the time. You certainly don't want to have problems with faulty wiring. Too me, electrical is dangerous and I always get someone with experience to do the hook ups (setting panels and breakers) for me. But I have a best friend who is a licensed electrician and he does my work for free :). Good luck.

[hunter]

When you say service provider I am assuming you are talking about the electric company I pay a bill to each month? The meter they read each month is on the outside of the garage wall and the boxes are on the inside of the same wall. The distance to the street is about 50 to 75 feet.
Would these distances make the price so high? You need give your best friend a lifetime supply of beer!

[dhill]

LOL, ya he drinks me out of house and home every time he comes up so I work his wazoo off for payment. Are you using only one meter? 50 to 75 feet isn't going to cause any price hike. In fact, most electric companies will run the line for you up to about 100 feet for no charge. I can't picture any reason why they'd be pricing those panels at 3K if they aren't running large wire across a significant distance. Seems like you need to get a second bid on your electric needs or a clear explanation as to why the cost is so high. Even with the control that licensed electricians have in residential installations, that price seems to be over the top to me, but I may be wrong because there may be some other factor determing that price quote.

[giddonah]

Even with the control that licensed electricians have in residential installations, that price seems to be over the top to me, but I may be wrong because there may be some other factor determing that price quote.

When your mayor is being investigated by the FBI the electrical work scams are pretty low on the list.

[Zatol]

Hunter... I am not sure of the conditions surrounding your project. If this gives you any perspective, I pay 1.75 per heated square foot for new construction here in NC. That price includes all material and labor for the complete electrical sytem (meter base, subpanel, circuit breakers, wiring, receptacles, switches, and covers) of the house including a subpanel in the garage.. The only thing not included are the light fixtures. So, for example, I just completed a 2300sf house and the electrical system cost me just a bit over $ 4,000...

[hunter]

Unbelievable! I am calling the electrician today to set up a meeting...I will let ya'll know the outcome.
I have a much better understanding of pricing and would like some explanations.
We financed ourselves carrying the builders risk insurance and everything...We told the builder we picked him to get his pricing from his subs. It is almost like this was a free for all because it was such a big house. I did not receive any volume discounts etc. We trusted our builder and I now know that was a big mistake. Yes he was recommended and his son lives down the street. Who would have thought??
All I want to do is finish and get him out of our life. It has been a nightmare that has taken up too much of our lives.
dhill....Yes there is only one meter.

[giddonah]

Who would have thought??

I've learned not to trust anyone to do anything I can do myself (or even learn to do myself). I don't even trust blood relations to do anything right. I only go by personal relationships that I've built over the years, and in Orange County, that means three people other than myself have my house's best interests at heart. Everyone else wants to screw me.

[dhill]

hunter, I sure hope this all works out for you and doesn't turn into a horror story. It's amazing how easily some people take advantage of one's good faith. In many ways I'm like giddonah, very careful to not trust someone until they earn that trust from me. I try hard to give everyone the benefit of the doubt, but I'm not seeing much reason for such high prices in your case; still, there could be circumstances. I hope you're not locked in to that electrical contractor if you find they are price gouging you.
giddonah, how the heck do you pronounce that name? I keep trying to form the word in my mind and I can't do it. :)

[Dragon]

Volume discounts?

For one house??

Sorry charley.

Its like this.

I had a builder the other day mention how he had paid me $100,000 in 2004. I told him yeah, and he really needed to step it up in 2005 because I received less money from him than any other builder.

Keep in mind that the $100,000 is gross, not net. Insurance, Payroll, materials, equipment, etc...etc... all come out of that.

[hunter]

Just talked to electrician. It will be 2 weeks before he will be able to meet with me because he is very busy. I briefly questioned him about the high price of the panel boxes and he first answered that he only uses quality materials....AND because of the knowledge base ya'll gave me I was able to tell him that I appreciated that and liked the fact that he used QO120AFCI and sq. D covers, etc., but that after pricing each box and all the breakers in it at retail pricing...my totals were 500 to 600 per box not 3,300 per box. He then said he had to account for overhead, gas, ins., salaries, etc. I said yes that was in all the other individual prices on the bid you gave me. I told him that all I wanted was for him to finish the job and not charge me anymore and the only way I could see this being done was for him to justify his prices. I will follow up in 2 weeks after the meeting.
If ya'll think of anything else I need to know for my meeting please let me know. I cannot tell ya'll enough times... thank-you, thank-you, thank you

[Zatol]

Hunter, I may have missed it, but what part of the country are you in?

[hunter]

Just North of Dallas Texas

[dengle]

So how'd it go?

I know it's a bit late, but i was quoted for a service upgrade from 60amp to 150amp in the Central New Jersey region. Work included just swapping out panels -- 1400 - 2100 depending on the contractor.

[Sparks]

dengle, how could one just swap panels when you're going from a 60a to 150a. What about the service entrance cable, or riser, or mast, or weatherhead, or grounding electrode system. If someone quoted you just to swap panels, there is no way they are planning on a code compliant installation.

[dengle]

Hmm, perhaps you're right. unfortunately, finances prohibited me from having the work done and my messy house ate the estimates.

It probably indeed included the other services required.

[Sparks]

:lol: My house sometimes eats paperwork as well. Ok, just didn't want everyone to think that all electricians routinely gouge people, Granted, there are some that do.

[porcupine]

I live in NY, and work with the IBEW Local#3. We make $42.00 and hour, and about $38.00 an hour in benefits for a total of $70.00 an hour per Journeyman, and I don't even think my employer could justify a $3,300 per panel add-on for on going work. That's ridiculous! Maybe $3,300 for ALL 3, and even that's a little steep, but acceptable, because you're sort of stuck with the thief. The contractors cost for materials couldn't be more than $500-$600, for all 3 panels with feeders.
Ok, you have a decent sized house, but I can't see him putting in more than 3-100 amp panels.
I charge (when I do side work) anywhere from $1300- $1800 for a complete 200 amp service, including meter pan, top drop, weather head, ground rod, soup to nuts.
Even if this guy is giving you all seperate services, it shouldn't be more than $3,300 for all services combined.
You should threaten to report this guy to local building agencies.