replacement windows

[ODDJOB]

Is the header expander required for installation or is it just to get a tighter fit ?
Thanks,

[Tom R]

It's mainly for a 'loose' fit, - - you don't HAVE to use it.

Normally, you WOULD need it because you usually have to 'angle' your window unit to get it in place, - - once it's in their straight you have a gap.

[ODDJOB]

Thanks for the info, Tom

[Tom R]

No problem, - - also, I always like to compress a strip of insulation in there, - - once the window's in it will also 'push' the cap up for you.

[ODDJOB]

Yeah, I usually insulate well and seal with caulk.

[TnAndy]

Those are 'idiot' caps......for idiot that can't meausre.....ahahahahaaaa....I've throw away a million of 'em.

In a wood jamb, I always pick the window up tight to the header, and insulate the space underneath.....then caulk around the 4 sides inside, and the sides and head outside. Trim coil is wrapped up under the vinyl sill......I never use a vinyl window that doesn't have a positive sill slope with an overhang.

[Tom R]

Well, - - I must be an 'idiot' :lol: because I leave the window sitting on the sill and simply raise the cap up to the top, - - the way the manufacturers 'intended'.

[TnAndy]

Ahahahaaa.....there I go, insulting without intent again.....the idiots to which I reffered where the window company salestwits that are pretty good with a ruler until they get to all those "little marks" between the numbers.....ahahahahaaa.......A window that ought to be 35 7/8" by 37 5/8" for a 36x38 wood window, you're lucky if you can get it 35 1/2 by 37 out of them.......and sometimes a LOT worse......

Nah, among the many reasons I don't use them, when you wrap the outside, having that "extra" layer of vinyl there at the head expander doesn't let the metal sit down tight on the window like the other 3 sides....same deal on the inside....that extra material of the header also pushes the window out a bit at the top instead of sitting flat against the inside stop.

Also, the frame thickness of a replacement is exactly 3 1/4"....since they were designed to replace two standard sashes. Most of the time, I cut off the outside storm stop on the two sides and leave the top stop in place. By using thel leaving the top in place, I put the window up and into the hole, using that as a "hinge" point. With the head expander on, I find that is just enough "extra" material that is won't go in a hole that measures real close to 3 1/4".

I do occassionaly use the head expander when installing replacements in a hole where there was a metal window and sheetrock returns.......the return will vary in side from window to window hole, and even from side to side depending on how careful the sheetrock was slapped on there.....when you set the window in the hole and the top is 1/8" gap on one side and 1/2" gap on the other, you about have no choice but to use them.


BUT as for what the "manufacturers intended", hellO.....don't even start down that path......because the knucklehead that designed some of this stuff obviously have NEVER put an actual window in an ACTUAL hole......they just sit at a drawing board and think "yeah....that's nice" and leave it to the installers to make up for their screwups.

As I mentioned above.....the positive sill slope. Ever see a welded window with a 45 degree profile all the way around the outside face ?.....and a couple of little weep holes for drainage ??? ahahahahahaaa......it must have been a design from someplace it never rains, and the don't have dirtdaubbers ( little mud nest building wasps that just LOVE a hole like that ) or spiders to plug up the holes......to say nothing of trying to wrap that bottom and get some kind of waterresistant seal......when the weep holes get plugged, the outside of the window profile being higher, GUESS where the water runs......yeah....down the inside of the walls.......ahahahahaaa.....what a hoot ! I could go on for several more pages on screwed up designs from "what the manufacturer intended"......but in the real world, it often ain't worth crap.


Andy

20,000+ replacements installed and counting !

[Tom R]

I'll try to address just a few of the points you make, - - with everyone keeping in mind, of course, - - there's no lack of respect at this end for Tnandy's 20,000-window-resume (and his ever-amusing posts)!!

Let's see, - - first of all, - - the exterior.

Top cap, - - I simply cut a notch at both ends so the top fits as 'flush' to the stops as the sides.

Bottom gap, - - I slide a filler strip under that's just shy enough of full thickness to allow my coilstock-wrap to slide between it and the bottom of the window unit. The automatic-angle drains water out and away.

Drain-holes clogging, - - this would fall under customer maintenance.


Interior.

Top Cap, - - again, - - notched to accept side-stops. Top interior-stop gets 'ripped' about 1/16" narrower to 'allow' for top cap.


IMPROVISE, OVERCOME, ADAPT. (or I won't laugh at your stories anymore) :lol:

[Tom R]

Oops, - - forgot to mention the top-exterior-stop gets 'knifed' back 1/16".

[TnAndy]

Well Tom.....I don't wanna lose a loyal fan of my stories....ahahahahaaaaa


IMPROVISE, OVERCOME, ADAPT.

Shoot buddy, I HAVE ! ......I throw away the top cap, and the sill angle they supply as well......and I suppose I shouldn't admit this, but also usually pull the "jamb adusters" out of the sides.....those that haven't already fallen out if they use those crappy little plastic ones with the screw head in the inside so small you can't get any kind of screwdriver hardly in the slot to "adjust" anything anyway.....( I use another 2-3" screw thru the vinyl back behind the balast cover to adjust the jambs and hold 'em rock solid ).....

I've got one manufacturer I use ( and they are NOT my choice of windows, but the guy that sells them gives me a lot of install biz ) that puts 4 of the dadgum things down each side ....4.......on a 38" tall window, you can't possibly need 4 points of adjusment down the sides.....heck the bottom two are close enough to the corner that if you used a screwdriver bit in a 1/2 socket and a ratchet with pipe on it, you couldn't adjust the fool thing out......the frame is WAY to strong at that corner...... I pull 'em all out and stick 'em in a Bigger Wendy's cup.....then when the cup is full, I drop them on the desk of the window company with the suggestion "I don't know what these cost, but WHATEVER it is, you are wasting your money!".........ahahahahahahahaaaaaaa


Ah, heck.....we'll just keep putting in our own way........I think that's why Ford quit painting their vehicles all black.......ahahahahahaaa

[Tom R]

Yeah, I agree, - - jamb adjusters are cheap and useless.

And yeah, - - the windows in general are cheap as can be, - - but that's the positiong the 'cheap' public has put themselves in.

I wouldn't have really stopped reading your stories, - - they're too funny for that, - - just would have stopped admitting to it!! :lol:

[TnAndy]

You CLOSET comic, you.....ahahahahahahaaaaa

I agree with you totally on the "cheap" deal...personally, I wouldn't have one in my own house.....but then I know how to take a sawall to a wall, and install an Andersen or Pella window....on the flip side, though.....I guess even the cheapie replacements are doing a heck of a lot better job of holding heat or AC in that the leaky dadgum single paned, wood sashes they replace.....I know the noise factor goes WAY down with them.

Tell ya'll an interesting story ( #12819 of a million I've got...ahahahahaha....non humor category ) on LowE glass.....

I bought a little solar battery charger for AAand D sized batteries. Got a flip up solar panel and a meter on it to tell you the charging time based on the sun on the meter. So I'm playing around with it the first day I get it ( it's like Christmas here pretty regular...ahahaha ) and I'm sitting at a table on our Florida room....sunporch kinda thingy....Sun is just pouring in the closed window, which is an Andersen casement with LowE glass. Meter is only reading about 1/2 on the charger.....wow, I'm thinking....this thing ain't worth much.....and I mean, full, direct , bright sunlight too.....so I step out on the deck.....PING....the meter pegged out ! First real visible, measureable demo of the LowE glass effect I'd ever seen !

End of Story....ahahahahaa

[ODDJOB]

Thats a definant, even the cheap windows w/ low E made a tremendous difference in sound and the sun's rays.

[roger g]

All very interesting though I haven't a clue what youguys are talking about what with expanders and clips and adjusters etc etc. What happened to just plain windows? It's been awhile since I replaced any windows though in the very near future I will have to and I am sure everything you guys say will make sense. I only hope I can find this thread when I need it.


roger