2 sensors and 2 switches controlling 1 set of lights...

[mesame]

In a nutshell: I'm wondering if it is possible to activate a set of outdoor lights through either one of two occupancy detectors while allowing two switches to force the lights on manually.

Background: I have a row of four lights starting at street level leading up along a set of stairs to the backyard. What I would like, is a sensor at street level and a sensor in the backyard, which will turn on all four lights if someone is in either location. In addition, I would like to be able to force the lights on manually via two switches inside the house, one on the first floor at street level and the other on the second floor at backyard level.

Questions: Can this be done? I assume that this is a 4-way switch situation -- is this correct? Does anyone know if there are motion sensors that can work in such a circuit? I would like too avoid using a wireless setup; while easy to use and expandable, I prefer to reduce the amount of RF signals around the house to an absolute minimum.

What I looked at: I looked at solutions at OSH & Home Depot but didn't really find what I was looking for. The senors they offer can be combined with a switch, whereby toggling the switch within a few seconds toggles manual and sensor mode; the sensor returns to sensor mode automatically once daylight sets in. I don't think this type of sensor would work with another sensor and another switch in the same circuit as described above.

[mdshunk]

Yes, that's simple enough. What you describe that you want is parallel operation, so it's not a 3-way or 4-way arrangement. Use two standard single pole switches and standard motion sensors. Grounding omitted for clarity only. Here's your diagram:

[mesame]

Thanks, mdshunk that helps a lot! Just to be clear, in the diagram, I assume the black line represents the hot wire and the white one the neutral wire -- is this correct? Thanks!!

[giddonah]

yeah, black for hot, white for neutral. MD, wouldn't that mean that if you turned on the lights with one switch, the other switch wouldn't turn it off? Is there a way to make the switches work together?

[kadoka]

you would need to have the two switches in a 3-way set up or you would always have to turn off the same one you turned on to turn the lights off.

[mesame]

Connecting the two switches in a 3-way setup is not a problem, but how do I integrate the two sensors?

The two switches are to allow to force the light on and keeping it on until either of them is toggled.
The two sensors are to allow to turn the light on if the two switches toogled it off and keeping them on for a set period of time.

[mdshunk]

Nobody ever said that you wanted 3 ways. In any event, here's your drawing again with the sensors and 3 way switches.

[mesame]

Thanks for the updated diagram. I'll pass this to my handyman, who hopefully knows how to interpret it. In case he doesn't, what do the redish lines represent -- the common wire? Sorry for my ignorance.

[giddonah]

Yes, the common wire. There should also be a black wire there too. Get some 14/3.

My favorite 3-way switch diagrams:

http://www.the-home-improvement-web.com/information/how-to/three-way-switch.htm

[mdshunk]

Yes, the common wire. There should also be a black wire there too. Get some 14/3.

My favorite 3-way switch diagrams:

http://www.the-home-improvement-web.com/information/how-to/three-way-switch.htm
Nope, not the common wire.

The red wires on the motion controllers correspond with the red wires that are on an actual motion controller. They are the "switched hot" when motion is sensed. The red wires on the 3 ways is just a traveler. Same with the white. The black wire on both 3ways is the common on each. Power in on one, and out on the other.

[giddonah]

I didn't see the wires from the sensors as red, they show as a really dark red now that I look at it. You do have red between the switches though.